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Need help sexing 2 of my boesemani

 
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rainbowfishluvr82



Joined: 17 Aug 2017
Posts: 22
Location: Moreno Valley, California

PostPosted: Sun Sep 10, 2017 3:40 am    Post subject: Need help sexing 2 of my boesemani Reply with quote

Hello everyone. I currently have 7 rainbowfish and I thought I was 100% sure about the sex of all 7 until last night. 2 of my boesemani' s that I thought were females, I'm starting to think they are males that haven't fully colored up yet. The bigger of the 2 I've had for over a year and even though it's not super blue and yellow I can say that when I got it, it was a silver/green color what most females look like. Over time I noticed that the back end and tail started looking more yellowish. The smaller of the 2 also had the female coloring when I bought it last month but is now starting to look more blue and yellow. I do have 1 male Boesemani that I know for sure is a male but he is still a juvenile and is really blue and yellow. So I'm wondering if males take different periods of time to color up and it doesn't matter the size? The other reason why I think these 2 are possible males is because last night they were acting like they were either trying to mate or "fight". Not really fight but acting the way most male fish act when competing over a mate or during breeding season. I have attached pics. The first pic is of my definite male boesemani. The rest are of the 2 in question. Please reply asap because of these 2 are males I'm in trouble. That means I'll have to rehome my definite female, otherwise all the boys are going to fight over her! [/img]
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Rainbowfishluvr82


Last edited by rainbowfishluvr82 on Tue Sep 12, 2017 1:44 am; edited 1 time in total
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rainbowfishluvr82



Joined: 17 Aug 2017
Posts: 22
Location: Moreno Valley, California

PostPosted: Sun Sep 10, 2017 3:46 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

How do I attach pictures????
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Rob M



Joined: 22 Jul 2015
Posts: 1042
Location: Gillett, WI

PostPosted: Sun Sep 10, 2017 9:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

This forum doesn't have a way to attach photos. You need to upload them to a photo hosting website and then post the link it gives you here.

This is one of many free hosts, http://postimages.org/
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rainbowfishluvr82



Joined: 17 Aug 2017
Posts: 22
Location: Moreno Valley, California

PostPosted: Tue Sep 12, 2017 1:36 am    Post subject: Need help sexing 2 of my boesemani Reply with quote

Here's the pics

https://s26.postimg.org/4ji7mbhex/20170909_215551.jpg

https://s26.postimg.org/hqc8zl2i1/20170909_215456.jpg
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Rainbowfishluvr82
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rainbowfishluvr82



Joined: 17 Aug 2017
Posts: 22
Location: Moreno Valley, California

PostPosted: Tue Sep 12, 2017 1:42 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think the bigger of the 2 is definitely female. I don't see the first dorsal fin overlapping the 2nd. I think the smaller one is a male that hasn't fully colored up, looks like the 1st dorsal is starting to overlap the 2nd. I just don't understand why my female has been so aggressive lately. To the smaller one in the picture and aggressive towards my cory cats. She doesn't get picked on by my males and she's way more aggressive than they are to each other. Do females get aggressive if they're pregnant??
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Colin_T



Joined: 18 Feb 2009
Posts: 2777
Location: WA, home of the Salamanderfish

PostPosted: Tue Sep 12, 2017 12:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Are you sure they are pure bred boesemani? I ask because M. boesemani do not normally have yellow on the front half of their bodies, but the bigger fish in the picture has yellow all along the body, up to the head. That is not normal.

Juvenile M. beosemani look similar to females with a mainly silver body and some pale marks.
The following link is a female but juveniles look similar.
http://rainbowfish.angfaqld.org.au/Lake_Aytinio_female_Joel.jpg

As for dorsal fins overlapping, in good quality fish the male's first dorsal fin will overlap the front of the second dorsal fin, but in most captive bred specimens that does not happen.

Rainbowfish coloration will vary on the fish's mood and if there are bigger rainbowfish in the tank. Big dominant male rainbowfish will bully smaller males and the smaller males will not color up like the dominant males. If you have several similar sized males they will be fine and show good color. But if you have big and small males the small ones won't look as colorful as the big ones due to being stressed and bullied.

However, if you have 10 or more fish in the tank, any aggression will be spread around all the fish and there won't be any issues. And rainbowfish aggression is not like agro cichlids that kill their tank mates. Male rainbowfish will bully smaller males and sometimes females but they don't normally try to kill them.

As for female rainbows becoming aggressive when carrying eggs, the answer is no. On rare occasions a female fish might become aggressive but it is not the norm. If the fish is bullying another fish it is probably male.
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Kicked a black cat? Sounds more like ran over one, backed over it, hunted down its mother and did the same
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rainbowfishluvr82



Joined: 17 Aug 2017
Posts: 22
Location: Moreno Valley, California

PostPosted: Wed Sep 13, 2017 4:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I don't know if they are purebred because I got these ones from the lfs. They always carry Boesemani though and all look pretty similar. In my opinion she looks like a Boesemani. Keep in mind the particular lighting when taking that pic made them look different. She is more of the silvery/green color. I currently have 7 rainbows in the tank. I've got 2 very beautiful male turquoise, 1 beautiful male picta, 1 beautiful male boesemani, the female in the pic, the young one in the pic that I think is a male and another young small Boesemani that I got around the same time that I think is female. Unfortunately some I thought were female, turned out to be male so that's why my sex ratio is off. I started out with just the big female. Then I added the bigger male turquoise. They never really bothered each other. Then I added my small male turquoise and my male boesemani. All was fine. Then I added the small one in the pic and my other Boesemani thinking they were both female. Then I added my male picta. For the most part they all get along, and school together. For some reason my definite male boesemani chases my male picta, but rarely has an interest in the female Boesemani. Other than that there is normal chasing but not bad and not very often. But for some reason, these 2 in the picture were going at it over the weekend. I thought they were going to hurt each other. When they mate do they nip each other???? Either they are male and female mating, fighting or 2 females fighting which I find odd. My other one that I think is female isn't aggressive at all. I am fairly new to rainbowfish keeping. I've had my big girl over a year. She was my first rainbow. Eventually when I have the space I want to upgrade to a 75 gallon tank and add more females and a few more males. Right now none of them are that big. Most of them between 2-2.5" long and my 2 biggest about 3" long. My king betta is bigger than almost all my rainbows just to reference their size. They have plenty of room, driftwood, anubias plants, river rocks and floating plants along with some beautiful silk plants and decor. My water parameters are all perfect. I honestly don't want to rehome any of them. Today they are all acting a lot more calm.
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Colin_T



Joined: 18 Feb 2009
Posts: 2777
Location: WA, home of the Salamanderfish

PostPosted: Thu Sep 14, 2017 1:03 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

external lighting can definitely affect the color of fish so if the boesemani all came form the same place and the shop regularly stocks them, they are probably boesemani and the yellow is from the light.

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what is the male picta? beta picta?

if the male picta is similar sized to the big male boesemani, and all the other fishes in the tank are smaller, then the male boesemani is simply showing off to the next dominant male in the tank. This is quite common in rainbowfish, with males displaying and showing off to male fishes that are not rainbowfish. I have seen male rainbows display to barbs, big danios and even big tetras in my tanks.

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When rainbowfish are breeding they do not normally bite each other, but some males (including boesemani) can bite other males and even females. However, the damage is usually minimal. But as a general rule, male rainbows will display to females (and other males) but not bite them, and they do not do extensive damage to them.

You might have 2 young males that were displaying, and the bigger fish (in the picture) is simply less advanced with coloration compared to the smaller fish (which looks like a male).

Rainbowfish take time to show full coloration, and maximum color is not attained until they are at least 1 year old, and usually 2 years in the bigger species like M. boesemani.

If the smaller fish (from the picture) was at the petshop for a while before you bought it, then it might be older than the other fish in the pic, and be showing more color because it is older. Pet shops get regular shipments of fish in and will quite often have the same species of fish from different shipments in the same tank. This means some of the fish might have been in the shop tanks for months and others only a few days or week. Fish at petshops are usually kept in smaller aquariums compared to most home aquariums, and are not fed as well. Subsequently they do not grow as fast or as big at the shop, but they still age. So the smaller fish in your picture, could simply be an older male than the bigger fish in your picture. And the bigger fish in the picture simply has not colored up yet due to its age.

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Did you do a water change before the 2 fish in the picture, started to show off and "fight"? If you did, then the water change probably got them excited and they started showing off. Most fish are stimulated by water changes. In the wild it is the start of the rainy season that tells fish there is food and new habitat to explore. It also says to the fish, it is time to breed. In aquariums, we do water changes and that does the same thing as rain in the wild.

If the 2 fish in the picture had just matured, and you did a water change, then they would get excited and start displaying.
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Kicked a black cat? Sounds more like ran over one, backed over it, hunted down its mother and did the same
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rainbowfishluvr82



Joined: 17 Aug 2017
Posts: 22
Location: Moreno Valley, California

PostPosted: Thu Sep 14, 2017 4:41 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks for the reply. My male picta rainbowfish is actually the biggest one in the tank. The larger male turquoise is the second largest rainbow. The bigger one in my pics is the 3rd largest. My definite male boesemani is Tyne 4th largest. The larger one in my pics I think is female because I've had "her" over a year and she was at the lfs for a while before I bought her. I had seen her for a while and finally bought her. So she's for to be at least 1.5 yrs. old. The smaller one in the pic started coloring up about a month after I got "him". If the larger was a male, I would assume it would have colored up by now. I didn't do a water change before they starting "fighting". At one point they were nipping at each other. That was on Saturday. For the past 2 days I haven't noticed them acting like that. Is it mating season right now? Cause lately they all seem super hyper. Lol.
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Colin_T



Joined: 18 Feb 2009
Posts: 2777
Location: WA, home of the Salamanderfish

PostPosted: Thu Sep 14, 2017 6:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Rainbowfish are considered serial spawners. This means they breed continuously over an extended period of time. In an aquarium with lots of food and good conditions, they will breed every day for months on end. In the wild they will breed for several months while conditions are good and then stop. But in aquariums they don't always stop Smile

When the 2 fish started nipping at each other, did they do any actual damage? ie: is there bits of fin missing? Or was it all show and no damage occurred?
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Kicked a black cat? Sounds more like ran over one, backed over it, hunted down its mother and did the same
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rainbowfishluvr82



Joined: 17 Aug 2017
Posts: 22
Location: Moreno Valley, California

PostPosted: Fri Sep 15, 2017 5:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hello, well I'm certain the smaller one is a male because he's starting to color up even more now. I know they breed like crazy, but wouldn't I have had babies by now? I have 5 males and 2 females. But the males don't really bother the females. They usually chase each other. When they were nipping, there was no damage. None of them have ever physically hurt each other, it's usually just chasing, or doing that mating dance. So as long as my females are not getting beat up or bullied is it safe for me to keep them?
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Rob M



Joined: 22 Jul 2015
Posts: 1042
Location: Gillett, WI

PostPosted: Fri Sep 15, 2017 6:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

rainbowfishluvr82 wrote:
but wouldn't I have had babies by now?

You need to put a mop in the tank and check it for eggs. Fair chance they are breeding but eating their fry Sad

rainbowfishluvr82 wrote:
So as long as my females are not getting beat up or bullied is it safe for me to keep them?

Yes, they should be safe for now but keep an eye on them. Their behavior might change as they mature.
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